alassante
Councillor
Feanor suffered from ADHD which caused his love for shiny things...
Posts: 228
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Post by alassante on Aug 14, 2009 9:31:07 GMT -6
Would pregnant elves know not to drink wine and ale? Would they suffer from the same pregnancy issues that women do - morning sickness, swollen ankles, tiredness, etc? I know they don't get sick so I wasn't sure about the morning sickness. And back in those times they wouldn't know about fetal alcohol sickness I wouldn't think but even then I'm not sure that elves can have birth defects? The baby is Laureanna's (100% elf) and Elrohir's so is it possible that the human part of Elrohir could cause the mother to have some human like symptoms?
What about going into labor too early?
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Post by Darth Fingon on Aug 14, 2009 10:45:06 GMT -6
Would pregnant elves know not to drink wine and ale? Would they suffer from the same pregnancy issues that women do - morning sickness, swollen ankles, tiredness, etc? I know they don't get sick so I wasn't sure about the morning sickness. And back in those times they wouldn't know about fetal alcohol sickness I wouldn't think but even then I'm not sure that elves can have birth defects? The baby is Laureanna's (100% elf) and Elrohir's so is it possible that the human part of Elrohir could cause the mother to have some human like symptoms? What about going into labor too early? I think the answer to these is, 'Whatever you want'. There's been nothing said anywhere about any of this. Except that Elves do get sick, so morning sickness is in if you want it to be. See here.
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Post by surgicalsteel on Aug 14, 2009 11:41:47 GMT -6
From Letter#153: "Elves and Men are evidently in biological terms one race, or they could not breed and produce fertile offspring."
So I'd say Elves could potentially have any of the same pregnancy related complications as mortals, including morning sickness, swollen ankles, fatigue, and pre-term labor.
On the knowing not to drink wine and ale - as recently as a few decades ago, obstetricians in at least one part of Ireland were still advising their pregnant patients to drink a small amount of Guinness every day, because it's high in iron (helps with pregnancy-associated anemia - my mother-in-law was told to do this when she was pregnant). Prior to that, some physicians and midwives believed that beer was healthier than water as a beverage. I think the actual reason for that is simple: the water used in beer making has been boiled, so it wouldn't be as bacteria-laden as water from a communal source.
I'd say it could be whatever you want on the ale and wine, and I wouldn't worry about the fetal alcohol syndrome. It doesn't happen in everyone who drinks while pregnant - it doesn't even happen in everyone who drinks heavily while pregnant.
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alassante
Councillor
Feanor suffered from ADHD which caused his love for shiny things...
Posts: 228
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Post by alassante on Aug 14, 2009 11:55:53 GMT -6
Thanks! I didn't think her having morning sickness would be too far fetched but I wanted to make sure. That article you wrote is great Darth.
The thing about elven pregnancy being different - length of pregnancy, control of when they get pregnant, etc - made me worry that their pregnancy could be very different. I'm not a stickler for canon but I do TRY to stay true to it.
The thing about the alcohol, Surgicalsteel, makes sense because back then they didn't have water filtration and probably drank spring water. Who knows what is in that! Alcohol back then might be less dangerous than now, I'm not sure how they made it then compared to now.
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sanna
Councillor
Eternal Bosom of Hot Love
Posts: 189
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Post by sanna on Aug 14, 2009 11:56:37 GMT -6
On the knowing not to drink wine and ale - as recently as a few decades ago, obstetricians in at least one part of Ireland were still advising their pregnant patients to drink a small amount of Guinness every day, because it's high in iron (helps with pregnancy-associated anemia - my mother-in-law was told to do this when she was pregnant). My grandmother was told to have a small glass of cognac every day when she was pregnant with my uncle and apparently ran a small risk of miscarriage. My mother was slightly miffed when she was given more modern medication instead of fine spirits when I threatened to be born all too soon.
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Post by nierielraina on Aug 14, 2009 12:29:44 GMT -6
On the knowing not to drink wine and ale - as recently as a few decades ago, obstetricians in at least one part of Ireland were still advising their pregnant patients to drink a small amount of Guinness every day, because it's high in iron (helps with pregnancy-associated anemia - my mother-in-law was told to do this when she was pregnant). My grandmother was told to have a small glass of cognac every day when she was pregnant with my uncle and apparently ran a small risk of miscarriage. My mother was told to have a glass of wine a day with me for the same reason. Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (a condition my step sister has) isn't so much a result of an occasional drink or even a glass of wine a day. It's more prevalent among alcoholics.
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Post by surgicalsteel on Aug 14, 2009 12:48:21 GMT -6
On the knowing not to drink wine and ale - as recently as a few decades ago, obstetricians in at least one part of Ireland were still advising their pregnant patients to drink a small amount of Guinness every day, because it's high in iron (helps with pregnancy-associated anemia - my mother-in-law was told to do this when she was pregnant). My grandmother was told to have a small glass of cognac every day when she was pregnant with my uncle and apparently ran a small risk of miscarriage. My mother was slightly miffed when she was given more modern medication instead of fine spirits when I threatened to be born all too soon. *laughs* Yes, I've heard of spirits being used for that reason, too. Cognac's much tastier than the meds used for the same thing. And my mother rubbed brandy on my gums when I was teething.
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Post by surgicalsteel on Aug 14, 2009 12:52:32 GMT -6
The thing about the alcohol, Surgicalsteel, makes sense because back then they didn't have water filtration and probably drank spring water. Who knows what is in that! Alcohol back then might be less dangerous than now, I'm not sure how they made it then compared to now. Fermentation and/or distillation. Oh, and freezing. Alcohol and water have different freezing points - freeze an alcoholic beverage and the water in it freezes at a higher temperature. Remove the ice and you've got a more potent potable than the one you started with. The equipment might've changed some, but the basics are still the same. I used to make crappy wine and distill it when I was in college. The organic chem students made wine every year as a lab project, and I was a chem major with keys to the lab, so it was easy to conceal my illicit project. ;D
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Post by surgicalsteel on Aug 14, 2009 13:01:44 GMT -6
My mother was told to have a glass of wine a day with me for the same reason. Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (a condition my step sister has) isn't so much a result of an occasional drink or even a glass of wine a day. It's more prevalent among alcoholics. True, but it's still not a 100% thing. The risk among heavy drinkers is about 30% - which means 70% of babies born to heavy drinkers don't have it. The risk for moderate drinkers is about 14% - and oddly enough, about 9% of babies born to women who claim to never drink a drop have defects consistent with fetal alcohol syndrome. It's theorized that may be due to nutritional deficiencies. Alcohol seems to impair placental transfer of zinc and essential amino acids (meaning the ones that your body can't synthesize so you have to get them from dietary sources), so it's believed dietary deficiencies of those substances might be the culprits in non-drinkers.
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Post by robinka on Aug 14, 2009 13:06:53 GMT -6
The equipment might've changed some, but the basics are still the same. Yes, and they didn't use sugar to make spirit, only grain or corn (not sure about potatoes, but let's leave them now ), which are healthier to begin with.
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Post by pandemonium on Aug 14, 2009 13:12:48 GMT -6
The thing about the alcohol, Surgicalsteel, makes sense because back then they didn't have water filtration and probably drank spring water. Who knows what is in that! Alcohol back then might be less dangerous than now, I'm not sure how they made it then compared to now. Fermentation and/or distillation. Oh, and freezing. Alcohol and water have different freezing points - freeze an alcoholic beverage and the water in it freezes at a higher temperature. Remove the ice and you've got a more potent potable than the one you started with. The equipment might've changed some, but the basics are still the same. I used to make crappy wine and distill it when I was in college. The organic chem students made wine every year as a lab project, and I was a chem major with keys to the lab, so it was easy to conceal my illicit project. ;D You might enjoy reading the article by Bert Vallee, professor of biochem. at Harvard whose research covered quite a bit on alcohol dehydrogense: Alcohol in the Western World: A History. (Don't be scared, non-scientists! It's written for a lay audience). An excerpt: As an aside, my grad school advisor post-doc'ed with Vallee for about a year before he escaped. Yes, escaped. Vallee had an army of post-docs in his lab that he kept as low-paid servants. Whenever they'd attempt to leave to find another job, he'd "blackball" them, giving them poor references, etc. But he was a well-spoken, "nice" guy. My advisor managed to make a break for freedom and was successful. Back to Elven pregancy. Let's see...placental based mammals? Check. Estrogens and progestins? Check. Nuclear hormone receptors? Check. Capable of being ill? Check. A one-year gestation!? Obviously written by a man with no clue.
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Post by jael on Aug 14, 2009 14:57:42 GMT -6
My mother drank socially during my gestation. And she took an aspirin if she had a headache and even painted my nursery -- with oil-based lead paint. It's really a wonder my generation isn't all mentally challenged.
You'd never know that based on what gets reported in the media. I've often worried that the scare tactics might actually inspire more abortions in women who have had a few drinks before learning they were pregnant.
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