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Post by Darth Fingon on Feb 2, 2009 20:36:58 GMT -6
So, following a discussion of an early map of Arda and its usefulness on GoI, I decided to look at said map and see if it fits in with later geography. I overlaid it with the map of Third Age Middle-earth and came to a heretical but interesting conclusion: Cuiviénen is in southern Gondor. Green lines: Middle-earth in the First Age Red lines: Middle-earth in the Third Age Blue line: conjectural path of the Great Journey from Cuiviénen. The Blue Mountains and Grey mountains both line up perfectly. The 'lost' Red Mountains, after the war of wrath, become the western border of Mordor in the south and Erebor at the extreme northern end (everything else is lost). The Misty Mountains are not on the Arda map, but we have to assume that they are there in the First Age due to the important role they play in the journey from Cuiviénen. The Sea of Helkar partially drains into the Bay of Belfalas, uncovering more land in Gondor. Comparing travel times in LotR with UT, the mileage matches fairly closely across Beleriand and Eriador at this scale.
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Post by aearwen on Feb 2, 2009 21:11:12 GMT -6
I love it - and it actually makes a lot of sense. I look forward to your rolling this new "heresy" out and watching the canazis spaz over it... ;D Warn me - and I'll make popcorn for the show... ;D ;D
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Post by jael on Feb 3, 2009 10:53:19 GMT -6
Gah -- Darth! You do realize this chucks a very important story element of mine right into a cocked hat?
I've going to continue to follow Karen Fonstad's maps which juxtapose perfectly from Great Journey to Third Age -- with the Sea of Rhun being the northernmost remnant of the Sea of Helcar and the Sea of Nurnen in Mordor being another puddle.
The Arda Map at EoA seems to be crudely drawn -- it could actually end up the same way.
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Post by Darth Fingon on Feb 4, 2009 14:25:15 GMT -6
Gah -- Darth! You do realize this chucks a very important story element of mine right into a cocked hat? Awesome. Which one?
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Post by oshun on Feb 4, 2009 15:11:04 GMT -6
That is so cool.
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Post by jael on Feb 4, 2009 17:54:09 GMT -6
It's a two-parter, really. I've already written that at the end of the First Age, the land shook and then the sea dried up, leaving Cuivienen high and dry and forcing Thranduil's wife's people to pick up and head west. They fetch up in the Great Greenwood and the rest is history.
Well, later chapters of King of Shadowed Halls will reveal that it was Dach-nai's (Lalaithiel's) father, Turon, who made that decision to leave Cuivienen, and he got the same grief from his wife as Thranduil will get over the move north to the caverns.
The second part is an element in an as yet to be written story. There are still elves at Cuivienen, although they are now desert-dwellers and very, very odd.
So, if the Sea of Helcar is merged with Belegaer -- no desert, no odd elves from the east. Hence my loud shrieks of protest. LOL
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Post by Darth Fingon on Feb 4, 2009 19:53:50 GMT -6
The second part is an element in an as yet to be written story. There are still elves at Cuivienen, although they are now desert-dwellers and very, very odd. I like the sound of that, and I hope you write this story soon. Even if it means putting Oropher on hold even longer.
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Post by DrummerWench on Feb 5, 2009 18:48:29 GMT -6
I would like to read that soonest. Please schedule your muse's time accordingly. Thx. Seriously, that is a fascinating idea. Odd is good. Go! Go! Go!
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