some questions about Angband & Tol Sirion

[eli]

I am doing a lot of research on Angband for the story I am writing since it is the main setting for it.

1.) About how big is Angband? It says the Thangorodrim were the tallets mountains so I am assuming Angband was pretty damn huge.

2.) I am finding a lot of information about the underground dungeons. But how much of Angband is above ground besides the gates?

3.) Would Sauron have vacated Tol Sirion imediately after the incident with Luthien, Huan, and Beren? Would he have been there long enough to take another captive going after that group or is it more likely he captured someone in Taur-nu-fuin?

4.) Where is Taur-nu-Fuin.? Is there any references that say how long Sauron stayed there? Is it possible for someone heading to Tol Sirion to get lost in Taur-nu-Fuin?

5.) Did Sauron go directly back to Angband after dwelling in Taur-nu-Fuin for a time? Or is it also plausible he went other places as well?

I do not own many of the HoME books so I am wonderin if there are any speicific excerpts or portions from those books regarding all of this that I should be aware of.

Thank you very much for any help given on this. While I do not want to be a Canatic about this (far from it) I also do not want to to ignore any major details that may make my story unbelievable.

Eli

[lilithlessfair]

3. As for this one, I believe Sauron left immediately after he surrendered the tower to Luthien.

Here's the relevant passage from the Silm:

But no wizardry nor spell, neither fang for venom, nor devil's art nor beast strength, could overthrow Huan of Valinor; and he took his foe [Sauron] by the throat and pinned him down. Then Sauron shifted shape, from wolf to serpent, and from monster to his own accustomed form; but he could not elude the grip of Huan without forsaking his body utterly. Ere his foul spirit left its dark house, Luthien came to him and said that he should be stripped of his raiment of flesh, and his ghost be sent quaking back to Morgoth; and she said; 'There everlastingly thy naked self shall endure the torment of his scorn, pierced by his eyes, unless thou yield to me the mastery of thy tower'

Then Sauron yielded himself, and Luthien took the mastery of the isle and all that was there; and Huan released him. And immediately he took the form of a vampire, great as a dark cloud across the moon, and he fled, dripping blood from his throad upon the trees, and came to Taur-nu-Fuin, and dwelt there, filling it with horror.

So, if Sauron captured someone, it'd likely be in Taur-nu-Fuin. Also, remember that he was wounded when he fled Tol-in-Gaurhoth.

4. It's also referred to as Dorthonion as is located between the northern part of Belerian and Ard-Galan. There's a map online here -- www.oneil.com.au/tolkien/maps/map_beleriand.html. Tol Sirion is to the west, past Gondolin and the Encircling Mountains.

5. I don't think his, er, travel plans so to speak are made entirely clear, but I suspect there are other Lizards with a far better knowledge of them.

[eli]

Thank you so much for your help on this Lilith. I am still in the process of fleshing out plot details for my story. I have the basic plot down but need to work on the details. Without giving too much away a certain character from Doriath is trying to catch up with Luthien and Beren. But since this character has left Doriath only once or twice I can easily see him getting lost in Taur-nu-Fuin especially if he is trying to avoid getting caught by sentinals or spies from Angband. I do not know yt if the character from Doriath has a companion with him or not. I have not decided that yet.

It looks like there's some room to play around here which makes me happy. It is always fun to add your own spin to things. Also if Sauron is wounded then that adds something extra to the plot too and helps me figure out why this character would even cross paths with Sauron and simply not run off when he found a stranger in the woods.

Is it just me or does anyone else almost type Taur-no-Fun instead of Taur-nu-Fuin?

Thank you for the help Lilith. And if anyone has any other things to add or any other thoughts I am all ears.

Also another question came up. We know Sauron has a wound to the throat but is it also possible he has other wounds too? I know with the dog attacks we would get at the hospital it was rarely just a single wound to the victim and it sounds like Sauron put up one hell of a fight too.

[lilithlessfair]

Well, remember that your character from Doriath is a learned fellow and, though he may not have had much experience traveling in the wide world, he'd have a decent knowledge of the geography from time spent studying maps. Now, I don't mean that he couldn't or wouldn't lose his way, simply that you might want to indicate that he's not unaware of basic geography. As you well know, things can look a lot different on the ground and abstract knowledge doesn't always translate into practical.

Also another question came up. We know Sauron has a wound to the throat but is it also possible he has other wounds too? I know with the dog attacks we would get at the hospital it was rarely just a single wound to the victim and it sounds like Sauron put up one hell of a fight too.

I imagine he'd have a number of other wounds.

[eli]

That is true that he is a pretty learned fellow. But like you said things never look the same on a map as they do in person. He could have also gone into the woods to find food too or supplies. Also I think any Elf from Doriath is going to know a lot of fantastic places to hide in the woods. Better to hide in the woods than wandering around out in the open. But like you said it is better to indicate that he does have an idea about what he is doing instead of wandering aimlessly. If he has tracked Luthien and Beren that far he clearly knows how to get around.

And who knows, since Sauron is wounded he is more likely to wander around in a bit of a daze for a little while. I would think even a Maia in a mortal body is not immune to the effects of wounds such as shock and other efects of blood loss. And I envision Sauron as smart enough to do what he needs to to get medical help from someone else if it happens to wander into his path. Plus an outsider has information.

Thank you Lilith for helping me with this. I am getting lots of great ideas from this thread. It is helping me solidify the ideas I have and how to make them work in a way that is believable. Of course I plan to have some fun with this and join the Heretic Party.

Eli