Elven burial customs and taboos

[grey gazania]

I'm currently working on a part of a WIP which focuses on the aftermath of the third kinslaying. Maedhros & Co. have come in, caused lots of bloodshed, and then grabbed Elrond and Elros and ran when they saw the ships from Balar coming. So the Sirion survivors and the people from Balar are now faced with a large number of dead bodies that they have to deal with.

They're basically right on top of an estuary, and they've got to have some source of fresh water, so presumably they'll want to try to keep those unpolluted. And they're going to be separating out the dead of Sirion from the Feanorian dead; grave mounds or cairns seem to be customary, so that's probably what the Sirion survivors will want to do for their people.

But burying everyone individually is going to take a lot of time and space, and what with Morgoth and the Hill of the Slain, I'd imagine common graves would maybe be taboo even when it comes to the Feanorian dead; is there anything to indicate that cremation wouldn't be a viable alternative, culturally speaking? (Or if you just have general points of objection/argument, I'm open to that, too.)

[Urloth]

First I guess you'd really want to explore the taboos and beliefs surrounding actual bodies and the separation of body and 'soul' in their beliefs.

Scraping at what I remember from my last death related course, a lot of cultures will, if unable to repatriate and honour their dead individually, would perhaps raise a mound over the mass grave or some sort of monument. Perhaps construct a temple or sanctuary nearby to honour and pray for the dead.

As for the enemy dead, again it all depends on the view of the body both in life and after death. They might have left them all lying about (perhaps you could look into sky burial?) but that's highly unhygienic as you've noted. If there are gorges nearby they might throw the bodies in there (after stripping them). If they're near a estuary I doubt they have a lot of really burnable wood so I don't think cremation is a answer for either group but who knows.

You might want to consider what the role of mourning and continued observance of the dead. If acknowledgement and observance plays a large part of the culture then its feasible your Sirion survivors might also construct a mass grave for the Feanorians without any marker so that they lie forgotten. The idea that they go buried and unmourned/unobserved in the proper way, perhaps dooming them (in local belief if you go that way) unable to find the way to Mandos/unable to be reborn.

Anyway that's been my scraping the bottom of the barrel when I should have been paying attention to my lecture. Hope it may have helped.

[elleth]

Historically speaking, a quick look around google seems to be saying that mass burials in a single grave mound are comparatively rare, although grave mounds seem to (occasionally) have been re-used at different times going by different strata. I'd still not rule it out completely, even with the possible taboo of the Haudh-en-Ndengin; the treatment of the dead will be a great deal more respectful, I'm expecting, than orcs piling casualties into a big heap.

The caveat is that I have no idea how the estuary's ecological system would react. There's a lot of water coming down Sirion, so I could buy the dilution of decomposing matter (willing to stand corrected, of course).

If you want a more viable alternative concerning resources and burials... cremation doesn't seem unlikely, at least not to me. The notable possible taboos here might be a too-close-for-comfort parallel with Feanor they might want to avoid seeing who attacked them (though that would make it perfect for the Feanorian dead?), and the Dagor Bragollach. Iirc the Haladin settling in Doriath burned Glaurung (and the Rohirrim much, much later, the Witchking's Fell Beast), though whether those were gestures of contempt or necessity I don't know. It would be possible (and wasn't an uncommon occurence in Neolithic Europe) to erect a mound or cairn over one or multiple urns, so even with cremation they could partly uphold burial customs. The Urnfield Culture might be a good place to research.

Re: Wood for cremation - they had sufficient resources for a great deal of shipbuilding, and the Lay of Eärendil specifically mentions Nimbrethil. I agree they'd have to foray inland - there are usually very few plants in salt marshes, and certainly no trees - but probably not far. Where I live, the coastal margin - marshes that are more or less salty and tree-less - goes for about 15km inland before a low geological ridge separates the Marsch and Geest, the more fertile inland area.

[Urloth]

I was thinking more along the lines of what I've learnt about the results of large battles such as the Peloponnesian war when there was a lot of dead and no way to bring all of them back home.

An after thought I just had is that if the Sirion dead are in fact dead in their home there is no reason why there wouldn't be separate burials or smaller mass graves (such as family groups). It all depends on how many dead and the seasonal condition aka can they bry them all before they begin decomposing badly.

[thoughtfulelf]

Mar 18, 2012 19:55:16 GMT -6 grey gazania said:

is there anything to indicate that cremation wouldn't be a viable alternative, culturally speaking? (Or if you just have general points of objection/argument, I'm open to that, too.)

In the real world, cultural taboos against cremation often had to do with the belief in resurrection (as in Christianity), or the need to distinguish oneself from despised neighboring cultures and their "heathen" funeral practices.

Now, the former wouldn't affect Elves (they are usually re-embodied after their stay in the Halls of Mandos, but preservation of the old body isn't necessary for that), and the latter would only matter if a despised-by-Elves group had a habit of cremating their dead. Yes/no?

[surgicalsteel]

possible taboos here might be a too-close-for-comfort parallel with Feanor

You could spin that a different way, too - Feanor burned up like a torch, and was well-respected enough that cremation is something only employed for the honored dead on our side - too good for those guys on the other side.

[surgicalsteel]

they are usually re-embodied after their stay in the Halls of Mandos, but preservation of the old body isn't necessary for that

Likely doesn't apply for this particular story, but I wonder if the Elves might've eventually developed a sort of prejudice against embalming the body for a couple of reasons - one, because it's simply not necessary. Two, because the Numenoreans seem to have become obsessed with death and with embalming, and certain groups among the Elves might've pointed to embalming and said that it's a ymptom of everything that went wrong with Numenor and part of the reason why Numenor fell.

Just a thought.

[randy]

First of all, Elf bodies decay more rapidly than those of mortal Men. To the point where some folks almost started the fanon of Elves simply going poof at the moment of death. Which of course they didn't -- only Feanor did that, and we have the example of Glorfindel's body being retrieved and placed with honor under a cairn.

Given the more rapid decay, I would postulate burial customs like that of Muslims -- as soon as possible, even on the first day. Mass graves or cremation? I have no idea. But there really isn't that much to go on. I'd say it's up to you.

The one thing I don't see is embalming and bringing bodies home from a battle site.

[pandemonium]

Mar 19, 2012 10:03:58 GMT -6 randy said:

First of all, Elf bodies decay more rapidly than those of mortal Men.

Other than the famous example of Fëanor, do you have any citations for this? From a personal (and scientifictitious) standpoint, the idea of rapid decay makes appeals (morbidly, I guess) to me, i.e., once the fëa departs and loosens its hold on the hröa, then senescence and putrefaction set in quickly. But that is an entirely fannish notion.

Some years ago, a colleague (fellow of Brahmin heritage from South India) and I had an interesting conversation about funereal customs, and how these often reflect the most ancient roots of a people. So...extrapolating here:

First, from HoMe X: "...in the days when the minds of the Eldalie were young and not fully awake, death among them seemed to differ little from the death of Men." Emphasis mine.

And from The Silmarillion

"Yet it is told that ere long they met Dark Elves in many places, and were befriended by them; and Men became the companions and disciples in their childhood of these ancient folk, wanderers of the Elven-race who never set out upon the paths to Valinor, and knew of the Valar only as a rumour and a distant name."

Using the most ancient roots idea, Elven funereal customs might be pretty similar to those of Men.** So there's a starting point. IIRC, there's a mass grave of the Men of the West from the battle of the Pelennor, no?

**Qualifying here: customs that might be similar as of the First Age, when GG's WIP takes place. The Numenorean obsession with death and embalming practices (reminiscent of ancient Egypt) came later.

I'm on the same page as Urloth, that is, mass graves.

[surgicalsteel]

First of all, Elf bodies decay more rapidly than those of mortal Men.

Source, please? I don't recall seeing this anywhere before.

[randy]

Other than the famous example of Fëanor, do you have any citations for this?

HoME -- I think it was from PoME, when JRRT was talking mostly about Dwarf bodies and how they take a very long time to decay vs. Men and Elves even more so. With the elves it was because of the faer/hroa thing -- how as time passes the body becomes more spirit than substance.

Give me some time and I'll chase it down. It came up very early inmy fannish career when Boz4PM was writing Okay, Now Panic and there was a scene where one of the Rivendell guards had been killed and brought back to lie in state, but another fan told her of this passage. There ensued a long discussion about whether they just go poof, with me citing Glorfindel's grave and Melian sitting vigil over the body of Thingol.

[pandemonium]

Mar 20, 2012 9:22:23 GMT -6 randy said:

HoME -- I think it was from PoME, when JRRT was talking mostly about Dwarf bodies and how they take a very long time to decay vs. Men and Elves even more so. With the elves it was because of the faer/hroa thing -- how as time passes the body becomes more spirit than substance.

Oooh, thanks! I'll have a look when I'm back at Chez Gilamancer. On the more spirit than substance, that's where I have a one-sided argument with JRRT from a life scientist's (sci fi that is) perspective: with many, many, many years of fending off oxidative damage to cellular components, the release of biological control, i.e., from the elven mind being tapped into their physiology, might make decomposition faster than that of their mortal brethren.

I'm interested in the notion as I'm using it in a WIP in which the Dark Muse notes that using Elves as "vessels" for his experiments in necromancy have been astoundingly unsuccessful because at the moment of said Elf's death, decomposition is so rapid. The DM has to "transfer" himself to a bodily vessel at just the right nanosecond, and that's proving to be difficult.

Give me some time and I'll chase it down.

That would be great! (See self-indulgent yammering above).

There ensued a long discussion about whether they just go poof, with me citing Glorfindel's grave and Melian sitting vigil over the body of Thingol.

Excellent! Even the notion of Fëanor's corpse just going "poof" has never set well with me, so I chalk it up to mythic hyperbole, akin to 8 foot tall Elendil (and an overly tall Sauron for that matter).