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Post by Darth Fingon on Sept 29, 2008 14:05:25 GMT -6
In the hope that somebody may be able to answer this:
How long might it take to sail from the Grey Havens to Númeor (specifically: Rómenna)? I'm estimating a distance of approximately 1500 miles based on available maps, though this seems very small.
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Post by oshun on Sept 29, 2008 15:13:46 GMT -6
I have no idea. I did not even know the distance. There could be extenuating factors: such as who is doing the sailing and is the weather good or bad or might there be extra-natural forces guiding the ship along the way. If you want to be real-world realistic you might look at sailing times from the Americas to England during the colonial period and extrapolate by comparing distances. (I don't have a source for this, but a Google search might give you one.)
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Post by Darth Fingon on Sept 29, 2008 15:23:01 GMT -6
I have no idea. I did not even know the distance. There could be extenuating factors: such as who is doing the sailing and is the weather good or bad or might there be extra-natural forces guiding the ship along the way. If you want to be real-world realistic you might look at sailing times from the Americas to England during the colonial period and extrapolate by comparing distances. (I don't have a source for this, but a Google search might give you one.) I've looked up sailing times for Columbus, which gave me an average speed of 90 miles per day. That would translate into a little under 17 days for a 1500 mile journey. But then you have to guess at routes and currents, and the size of an Elvish merchant ship vs the size of the Santa Maria. (My guess: an Elvish ship would be smaller, but of a more advanced construction, making them about equal in terms of speed.) So 17 days would be an 'average' trip to Númenor out of Mithlond, but an incredibly lucky ship could make it in 8 and a very unlucky ship might be much, much longer. But then, I know absolutely nothing about sailing, and all of this is courtesy of Google and potentially ridiculous.
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Post by oshun on Sept 29, 2008 15:27:04 GMT -6
I have seen an exact replica of the Santa Maria (can't remember where at the moment, somewhere in Spain) and it is very small (I was shocked--smaller than whalers and other tall ships I have seen on display in other locations), so I would not necessarily make the assumption that elven vessels for that kind of a trip were smaller.
I don't know any sailing experts of that caliber that I could easily consult.
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Post by Darth Fingon on Sept 29, 2008 15:36:29 GMT -6
I have seen an exact replica of the Santa Maria (can't remember where at the moment, somewhere in Spain) and it is very small (I was shocked--smaller than whalers and other tall ships I have seen on display in other locations), so I would not necessarily make the assumption that elven vessels for that kind of a trip were smaller. Again, based just off google: a random reference to mediaeval ships approximately 50 feet in length, which sounded about right for what I'm envisioning, and Santa Maria being 70 or so. (This is exactly why I prefer writing about dull politics on dry land. Preferably in northern climates.)
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Post by oshun on Sept 29, 2008 15:45:36 GMT -6
Were those 50-foot length ships making long ocean voyages?
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Post by Darth Fingon on Sept 29, 2008 16:54:03 GMT -6
Were those 50-foot length ships making long ocean voyages? The smallest sort of these ships is similar to what I have in mind: something compact that carries up to 20 people.
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Post by oshun on Sept 29, 2008 17:11:24 GMT -6
I don't think that there would be that much difference between 50 and 70 feet because there is a tall-sail race every year and I looked it up and the ships competing are between 30 and a little over 100 feet.
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Post by Darth Fingon on Sept 29, 2008 19:43:33 GMT -6
I think I'll just go with 16 days for now.
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Post by oshun on Sept 29, 2008 21:46:26 GMT -6
I'd buy that. But then I'm easy.
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Post by Gandalfs apprentice on Sept 30, 2008 17:03:34 GMT -6
Whenever Tolkien mentions ships, I rather get the impression they are of the Viking type: manned with one or two sales and some oars, but not all that big. Doesn't Earendil sail with just two or three others? Less than ten, anyway.
Try Wikipedia for some basics.
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Post by pandemonium on Sept 30, 2008 18:00:48 GMT -6
Whenever Tolkien mentions ships, I rather get the impression they are of the Viking type: manned with one or two sales and some oars, but not all that big. Doesn't Earendil sail with just two or three others? Less than ten, anyway. Try Wikipedia for some basics. Likewise I think of something like a Viking longship, in part because of the description of the Flight of the Noldor in The Silmarillion in which Fëanor and his followers are described as manning the hijacked Telerin ships and rowing them. For the latter day Númenórean warships (setting aside Sauron's instructions to the Númenóreans of how to build Evil™ metal-hulled, steam engine-driven vessels), the Roman galleons come to (my) mind. I really like the caravels though.
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